"Bold" Update

"K-Roll-PorscheTamer" (k-roll390) 01/15/2016 at 11:19 • Filed to: Bold Things

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So, here’s what happened...

I waited for her after class, and I think she was waiting for me as well? Not sure about that bit, but we walked and talked for a couple minutes, complaining about how one of our professors was wrong about an assignment due Monday. I then asked what she was up to for the day, she said she was done for the day, meaning we’ve got the exact same schedule on Fridays (one class and that’s it). I then proceeded to ask if she wasn’t busy, if she would like to “grab a bite or something”. She said she couldn’t because her brother just returned from teaching in China and she was gonna spend the day with him, we then got on the topic of travelling. But she ended the conversation saying she would let me know for another time.

So it’s not a strikeout, nor is it a rejection, because she didn’t say “NO”. So what now? I don’t know, do I ask again the next time I see her? At least it wasn’t a NO! ^_^

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:21

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Master Cylinder > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:22

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Sounds like a good start to me. Just take her at her word that she was actually busy (many people aren’t terrible lying assholes, so give her the benefit of the doubt) and try to ask her another time.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/15/2016 at 11:25

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I....I don’t, know what this means?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Master Cylinder 01/15/2016 at 11:29

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Ok. I just don’t wanna be too persistent to the point of annoyance or anything.

uofime-2 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:30

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The hindsight is 20/20 correct response was of course, “How about next Friday then?”

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > uofime-2 01/15/2016 at 11:31

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FUCK -_-

FazeRacer > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:32

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If she doesn’t bother to suggest another time then it’s a rejection. Sorry.

PushToStart > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:35

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Or at the very least gotten her number to plan something for another time. If you see her regularly though it probably isn’t a big deal.

uofime-2 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:37

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it’s ok I’m guessing you have class monday and wednesday too (unless this is a lab) so ask her then.

Also top tip, do what you can to make it clear that this is a date, not just friends going to lunch (If that’s what you’re intention is). As painful as that may seem it will save a great deal of further awkwardness later.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > FazeRacer 01/15/2016 at 11:38

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IT IS?? Well....I guess I’m going to that mixer tonight after all then...It’s alright, no one lost here. So now what, do I just give up?

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:39

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Its slang and it basically means “we did it” or “I succeeded”.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:40

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So do I gif dump happy things now because partial good news is news good?

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:40

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You did good! Sucks she already had a prior commitment but at least it wasn’t some BS reason. Next time you see her just keep it casual but don’t bring up grabbing lunch again until you know you both are done for day, maybe sometime next week mention “Hey if you aren’t doing anything on Friday, we should hit up such and such place”. If you ask her again like on Monday for example if you see her Monday’s you might get another “Sorry I have to do XYZ” which wouldn’t be good but nothing to do with you.

You did good though man. You’re on the right track.

Master Cylinder > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:41

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Yeah, don’t blow up her phone or anything like that. Just ask her next time you see her. Just remember - she didn’t shoot you down, so you’re still in it.

SkyNet > uofime-2 01/15/2016 at 11:42

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Child please. The correct response is a nonchalant, “Alright (or perhaps “Aight” if that’s what the kids are saying these days) maybe next time” with as much of an “I don’t really care that much” attitude as you can possibly muster. The less of a crap you give, the more of a crap they give.

Then you wait a couple weeks and give it another shot. If possible under the guise of “myself and some friends were planning to do “xyz” (beer pong, beer bong, beer-whatever the “youths are doing these days”) so it’s even more nonchalant. The goal is “I’m doing this regardless, if you want to come, that’s cool, if not, that’s cool too.”

Women are just like men in many ways. We all like a “chase” and we all value things that don’t come easy.

Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:42

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Took me about 3 shots like that to pursuade futurewife to go out with me.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 11:44

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Well I don’t know now. Someone said maybe she’s not interested in me because she didn’t give an alternative date or anything. I don’t know, I was happy before....now I’m just mixed.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > PushToStart 01/15/2016 at 11:44

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I see her every day at least once. She’s in two of my classes.

RockRam > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:45

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Good sign. Some girls like persistence and other don’t. If it’s one thing my friends and I say in these times, it’s “Don’t put the pussy on a pedestal”. Be you. If you want to ask her again, in a few days/weeks, do it. If you want to cool it and give her the option to ask you, do it. Now you have the confidence to ask other girls in different settings if it doesn’t work out.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > uofime-2 01/15/2016 at 11:45

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We have a class every day together.

I don’t know how to do that.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/15/2016 at 11:46

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Did I though?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Master Cylinder 01/15/2016 at 11:46

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I don’t even have her number....

PushToStart > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:47

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you’re good then. just make sure you keep the “boldness” and be consistent

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Rico 01/15/2016 at 11:47

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I’m a bit confused though now. What if by not mentioning or considering an alternative date, she’s not interested and I’m just wasting my time?

Should I go to a mixer party tonight instead?

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:48

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See this can go either way, she might not want to plan that far ahead she may have other plans on that day that are unforseen at the moment. Obviously family takes priority over anyone else so she might not want to plan for next Friday only to tell you maybe another time. Also that response can look a little thirsty, the fact that you kept it casual is key. Girls can smell thirst and once they do it’s pretty much over for you so what you did was fine.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > RockRam 01/15/2016 at 11:48

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Is it a good sign though? How can I be sure of it? I don’t think I can.

Textured Soy Protein > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:48

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We as 21st century humans have incredibly powerful computers in our pockets that are capable of sending messages to each other over a global data network. You can even talk on them too!

“Hey let me get your number, I’ll text you mine.”

Then you don’t have to like, make sure to position yourself at the right place at the right time to casually “run into” someone who you actually deliberately intercepted.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] 01/15/2016 at 11:49

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Like you asked her 3 different times?

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:49

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You’re in there like swimwear.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Textured Soy Protein 01/15/2016 at 11:49

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I didn’t do that....I forgot. :(

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:50

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Dude, don’t take the passive-aggressive approach. She didn’t flat out say, “No” so that is a partial victory. Dealing with romance is like war in Afghanistan-Vietnam-Iraq, very rarely will you experience a true full on victory, but most days you can achieve small results that can build to something great. Keep a cool, emotion-neutral head about shorty and you will do fine. The worst thing you can do is attempt to over-analyze and end up creating unnecessary non-existent tension. Also aren’t you going to NAIAS this weekend? RSaldana demands a photo-dump sacrifice!!!!! :)

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Rico 01/15/2016 at 11:51

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Wait, so am I good then? This is so confusing... :-/

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > PushToStart 01/15/2016 at 11:51

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Consistent in what way?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Rico 01/15/2016 at 11:51

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What does that mean??

smobgirl > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:51

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If you end up conversing with her again in the near future, try to remember to casually ask her something about her brother’s trip. Just, “so your brother lived in China? Did you ever get to go visit him there?” Or something - showing that you remember details is a good way of letting her know you’re actually interested.

I'd say if you think she was waiting, she probably was. Definitely try again at least once.

Future next gen S2000 owner > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:54

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It is simple. A time honored tradition of many before you who have asked one simple question. Many of us have fallen flat on our faces only to pick ourselves up and try again.

Make small talk on Monday and Tuesday, then mid next week, ask her if she would like to go out on a date that weekend. If she shoots down the first available time, ask her what is good for her schedule or propose a second date and time. If both fail leave it up to her. Don’t be that creepy guy that keeps bugging her. If you friends give you shit for failing, tell them at least you had the balls to ask and when was the last time they actually asked a girl out face to face, it probably wasn’t recent. Then tell them to fuck off.

Either way, if you fail you don’t want to make it awkward in classes going forward, be assertive but not stalkerish. You don’t want her avoiding you if she says no. If she does say no, wait a couple months and then say hey, I’d still like to take you out sometime and leave it at that. No follow up, nothing. Just let her know you are interested and the ball is in her court.

If you get shot down, keep looking and dating others. You may be surprised at what you find. Also, if you fail, try again. Also, try again. The worst they can do is murder you in your sleep.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 11:54

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Halp, an overthinking this -_-

And I’m going next week, not this weekend.

nerd_racing > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:55

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You are in your own head now man. Stop thinking what if, and just go with the flow for a couple days. Ask her Wednesday if she wants to do something after class Friday. So it’s not so far in advance, but enough time to actually clear her time if she wants to. But make sure you don’t act any differently around her. They smell nervousness... Trust me, I’m an engineer.

uofime-2 > SkyNet 01/15/2016 at 11:56

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Are you trolling?

In my experience none of what you said is true.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > smobgirl 01/15/2016 at 11:56

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Something positive that doesn’t leave my head exploding yay!! I can do that! Because I like adventure and travelling. ^_^

I will try again at least one more time. But I think I should wait a couple days.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > nerd_racing 01/15/2016 at 11:58

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I trust engineers because I’m in school to be one.

ly2v8-Brian > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:59

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Yes and no. You may have got turned down, but you built up some courage and confidence, try again. Keep going.

Future next gen S2000 owner > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 11:59

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Go to the mixer, practice talking to every girl you see. Try and get at least one actual date out of it.

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:00

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First off, always go to parties/get togethers/mixers anything that you can use as practice. Talking to the opposite sex (or someone you are interested in) is like learning to drive a stick. At first it seems confusing, hard, and maybe even a little scary but once you practice you can master it and therefore are always in control.

Girls very rarely will offer an alternative date, they also don’t want to look thirsty and they will likely wait for you to say another day since it was you who initiated it.

Also learn this lesson now, any time you talk to someone you are interested in or even someone you are not interested in but can use to overcome shyness should be considered practice. Small steps, as you start to learn more about body language, signs, how to keep conversations going and how to approach girls you start to hone your own abilities.

So even if the girl today flat out said “I have a boyfriend!” you still did more than most guys on here have done. You manned your nuts up and you went over and tried to ask a girl up, be proud of yourself. Other dudes would still be in the corner eating bon bons wishing they had the courage to go talk to a girl they were interested in but don’t have the balls to actually do it.

Textured Soy Protein > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:01

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Disclaimer: I’m very much out of the dating game since I live with my gf of 5 years, but back in ancient history times before Tinder, there were two very important things to remember:

Get her number but don’t blow up her phone. If you don’t get any response after a couple days, try one more time, then leave her alone. It’s easier for women to ghost you than to tell you they’re not interested, so let them.

If you meet a girl at some place, and you’re vibing and think it’s going well, suggest a change of venue. “Hey let’s go to ____ I hear they have good ____ there.” Agreeing to this is a sign of trust and interest.

RockRam > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:01

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lol. yea you can’t be sure. But just the fact that she spent the time to actually walk and talk with you says a lot and that's a good thing. I wouldn't read too much into her reasoning.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:05

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Well done, son!

PushToStart > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:06

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Consistency in your approach. Essentially, don’t get scared by her response today and never talk to her again. Keep trying to establish a good rapport, which will make both of you more comfortable. Eventually you’ll go from “being bold” by talking to her to just talking to her because that’s what you do.

SkyNet > uofime-2 01/15/2016 at 12:08

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Haha no, not at all.

In my experience (at least during college) everything I said is true.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:09

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So, when you see her next week, just ask her about her more about her brother and his work in China and how he likes it (if you didn’t already discuss this). Showing interest in him is showing interest in her and her family, and she’ll like that you remembered and want to keep learning more about her.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Textured Soy Protein 01/15/2016 at 12:09

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Why is this so complicated? I need to get out of my head. How do I get out of my head?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > RockRam 01/15/2016 at 12:10

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Ok, my head is evil and making conflicting overthinking thoughts.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:10

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Ah word. Hey I have a grand idea that will keep from a case of the overthinks......buy a land rover.....you’ll be so focused on try to make it work you can’t overthink the arena of romance.

Spaceball-Two > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:11

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I think you’re all good man. You see her frequently enough in class so just keep the conversation going next week without pressuring the date. She’s well aware you asked her out so the ball is in her court. Sounds like a good start to the weekend.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:13

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You stood up to your fears and took the answer as it was. You can ask again later and see what happens and if you get a no then you know you can at least ask someone. It’s a first step.

nerd_racing > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:14

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your situation sounds like me every time i like a gal

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 12:15

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Bruh, I bought a 30 year old Porsche, I think that’s enough thinking for two people.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Spaceball-Two 01/15/2016 at 12:15

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See? Tell me more positive uplifting things!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 01/15/2016 at 12:15

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I like progress

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > nerd_racing 01/15/2016 at 12:16

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Engineer thinking: overthink everything.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:17

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Dude imagine if you found a squeeze who was as into Porsche and working on old Porsche as you......

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 12:20

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Well I did once.....It didn’t work out AT ALL. You may remember it from that one time I almost bought a non-running fox body with said person....Moving on from that episode.

Spaceball-Two > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:24

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She secretly drives 5.0 Fox Body and has a hot twin sister with loose morals.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Spaceball-Two 01/15/2016 at 12:26

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Uhhhhh no.

Textured Soy Protein > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:26

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Um, it’s not complicated at all. Those are only 2 things to remember. They’re not the only things to remember but if you do them you’ll be fine.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:26

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Woah, plot Twist romance is crazy.

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:27

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Yeah man you’re good! Trust me. I have experience and haven’t been nervous/intimidated about talking to girls since I was like 13 maybe even younger. Everything I say to you is to lead you down the right way.

Xyl0c41n3 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:27

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Oooh! Sounds like it went well so far. Good luck, kiddo!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 12:28

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Thank god that one went nowhere.

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:28

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That you broke the barrier

Baeromez > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:29

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Here’s what you do now: Before you ask her out again, find another girl and ask her out in the meantime. You have to get used to playing the field, and you definitely have to get used to rejection.

Try asking out a different girl every week. You’ll get rejected over and over, but some some are going to say yes out of sheer probability. Eventually you’ll get very good at asking girls out, plus you won’t feel nervous on a date if you know you can just call up another girl any time.

uofime-2 > SkyNet 01/15/2016 at 12:29

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If you’re looking to hook up, sure. If you want to date, probably not the best approach

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Rico 01/15/2016 at 12:29

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Oh, that sounds good to me then!

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:30

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Alternate universe, K-Roll Foxbody tamer of the clan heartbroken.

Rico > SkyNet 01/15/2016 at 12:31

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Someone who gets it. We are a long way away from “May I have this dance” followed by swing dancing to whatever new track Billie Holiday put out.

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:33

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Listen to people with experience!! lol you did good man don’t let anyone tell you different.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 12:33

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Or, K-Roll FoxbodyTamer of the Jerry Springer Clan, as seen on TV.

Because god damn....

Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:34

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Yup.

She told me years later that she wasn’t really interested initially, but ended up humoring me. I was extremely passive in my approach, but persistent. “Hey, is anyone taking you home from work? Want to grab lunch after our shift? Etc”. It was only lunch after all! What could she possibly lose? That was over 7 years ago.

Rico > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:42

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Please don’t believe posts like above. Idk man not trying to disrespect anyone on here but some of these posts on your thread show me a lot of people really have been out of the dating game too long or have never been “good” at it. Some of the suggestions here are downright over the top and some assumptions here are why some people don’t get [understand] women in general.

SkyNet > uofime-2 01/15/2016 at 12:43

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First of all. These are college kids! There’s very little difference between the two.

Second, whether he is looking to hook up or date, he needs the girl to like him or “say yes” at some point. He needs to be nice and respectful, but he also needs be confident and to act like he will be fine either way (because he will!)

SkyNet > Rico 01/15/2016 at 12:44

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SkyNet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:49

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Yes. You’re fine! Once again, build the basic relationship with her like you have been (talking after class, etc) while making sure you don’t get friend zoned. Don’t be over eager, tell her a bit about yourself, be confident even if you aren’t (fake it till you make it!). Then try again in a few weeks in as non-chalant a way as possible. The less she thinks you care, the more likely she’ll say yes.

Remember, there are plenty of fish in the sea. Even if this one gets a way, it’s just a drop in the bucket. Take this time to learn about yourself as a person and put yourself out there. In 5+ years you’ll start to learn who you really are and then you can work to find “the fish you hang above your mantle” (AKA your wife). In the mean time, have fun and remember you’ll look back at these minor rejections as nothing more than a learning experience.

nerd_racing > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 12:52

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Its more my nerd side. Oh look pretty girl, quick, forget how to talk, start sweating, and mumble a little bit...

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 01/15/2016 at 12:53

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That’s actually some pretty solid advice!

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 01/15/2016 at 12:58

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Thanks. I’m almost 38, and married the first girl I ever really dated, so I’m by no means an expert, but I do know people and how they tick...

Blunion05 drives a pink S2000 (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST) > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 13:13

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Is she by any chance texting often on her phone?

StndIbnz, Drives a MSRT8 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 13:21

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Well done! Don’t be too pushy if she says she’ll let you know, let it slide for a few days. Don’t want to seem needy either. But, its a great first step and seems promising!

Frenchlicker > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 13:42

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In my experience never say or something. Confidence, even if pulled out of your ass is key. But definitely ask her out again. Also, do not take the “play the field” advice. You clearly know what you want.

FazeRacer > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 13:53

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Yes you should go to the mixer tonight. For one, never put all your eggs in one basket (or one woman in this case). A lot of women won’t outright reject you, they will be vague and hope you go away. In the dating game you need to work volume, you should always be acting on opportunities and dating multiple women.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 14:06

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lol, well you at least have to sense of humor variable of the romance equation settled.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 14:08

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I've watched too many sitcoms to not have it down. ^_^

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 14:10

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Frasier watcher/fanfiction maker here

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 14:14

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Hey I’ve got questions about your exhaust for the FoST. Do you know of any aftermarket versions that have a single center exhaust port. I don’t like the non-linear look of the Cobb, Ford Racing, Mountune. i think the stock version looks best (even though it is actually a dual central)

luvMeSome142 & some Lincoln! > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 01/15/2016 at 14:18

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Solid advice.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > nerd_racing 01/15/2016 at 14:39

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Yeah.... :/

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Blunion05 drives a pink S2000 (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST) 01/15/2016 at 14:40

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Uhhh....I don’t know? We’re both on our phones before class. She wasn’t on her phone when we were walking and talking. Why?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 14:43

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All the aftermarket ones I’ve seen are dual exit. Although I saw one on a forum that was custom with the OEM tip.

R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/15/2016 at 14:44

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That’s what I am thinking I will be doing if I get to upgrade the exhaust find something similar to one of the high quality aftermarket ones but put a single exit on it.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet 01/15/2016 at 14:51

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It’s worth a shot I bet.

uofime-2 > SkyNet 01/15/2016 at 14:54

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I graduated in 2013, I still remember college pretty well.

I’m sure you know“not caring” is a good crutch for confidence but generally not desirable in and of itself.

Trying to meet up at bars or parties, is often frustrating if you don’t already have some degree of closeness. I am a rather impatient person, in this case likely to my detriment on numerous occasions.

Ideal date, go to dinner later 7-8, start drinking (if of age), if that goes well, go to pregame, hit party and/or bar